How Relationship Science Helps You Stay Or Go With Clarity with Merideth Thompson

Uncertainty keeps smart people stuck. We go straight at the fog—why it forms, how it hides real risks, and what evidence says actually makes love last—alongside Dr. Meredith Thompson, a negotiation scholar and founder of Partner Lab. Meredith breaks down how emotional and financial control often masquerade as care, how gaslighting disconnects you from your body’s alarms, and why staying “for the kids” can teach the very dynamics you hope to avoid.

We map the science of healthy relationships into plain language: perceived partner commitment, genuine responsiveness to everyday bids, the power of appreciation, sexual satisfaction as connective tissue, and the non-negotiable absence of controlling or abusive behavior. You’ll learn to distinguish support from enabling, track subtle red flags in daily life, and use influence mapping to focus on what you can actually change. When safety is a concern, Meredith outlines how to plan a departure with a team and why the most dangerous moment is often declaring it’s over.

For anyone trapped in ambivalence, we introduce practical tools: Partner Lab’s Clarity Circle to make a grounded stay-or-go decision and a Clarity 360 assessment that spotlights strengths and gaps across 24 dimensions. We also tackle realistic setbacks—cyclical breakups and financial strain—and the rebound many experience after the storm passes. To counter spiral thinking, we use fear-setting to name worst cases, prevention steps, recovery plans, and the opportunity cost of staying stuck. Healthy love isn’t guesswork; it’s informed, self-respecting choice. If the conversation helps, follow the show, share it with a friend who needs clarity, and leave a review to help more listeners find their way.

Chapters

• 0:08 From Uncertainty To Clarity
• 0:39 Meet Dr. Meredith Thompson
• 1:01 Why People Feel Stuck In Relationships
• 3:20 Invisible Abuse And Financial Control
• 6:11 Myths About Commitment And Health
• 10:22 Ripple Effects On Work And Life
• 13:19 What Science Says Really Matters
• 16:37 Deal Breakers And Safety Planning
• 19:04 Control What You Can Change
• 20:41 Day-To-Day Red Flags To Notice
• 24:30 Support Versus Enabling
• 26:43 Turning Awareness Into Action
• 28:21 Tools: Clarity Circle And 360
• 31:11 Common Setbacks When Leaving

Transcript

SPEAKER_01: 0:08

Most people don't stay in unhealthy relationships because they are unaware. They stay because they are unsure. Unsure if the things can improve, unsure if leaving is a mistake, unsure if their feelings are even valid. So today's conversation is all about replacing that confusion with clarity using relationship signs, not a gay spoke. So hey dear listeners, welcome back to another powerful episode of Mind Meets Machine. I am your host, Abek, and today I am joined by a lovely guest. Please welcome Dr. It Thompson. So welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_00: 0:52

Thank you so much. I'm super excited for this conversation.

SPEAKER_01: 0:55

So dear listeners, before we delve deep into the discussion today, I'll quickly love to introduce with Dr. So she is a negotiation profession, PhD in organizational behavior, and founder of Partner Lab, where she helps people make better decisions in their closest relationships using research-based tools. We are exploring how relationship science can help us strengthen the healthy relationships or know when it's time to mindfully end one. So without guilt, drama, or self-betrayal. So why to it?

SPEAKER_00: 1:39

Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_01: 1:40

So Meredith, like you work with people who are often stuck between staying and leaving. So when someone comes to you feeling confused about their relationships, then what is the I mean, what is usually driving that confusion underneath that surface? What do you say?

SPEAKER_00: 1:59

Oh, that's such such a good question. And I think it it relates to some of the factors that you pointed to in the beginning of this episode. You know, it's they're unsure. Maybe they're unsure about what is actually going on in the relationship. So often it's hard to get that clarity when we're in the thick of it and it's a slippery slope to, you know, dysfunctional or unhealthy relationships. For a lot of people, it's fear. So the and the that fear keeps them stuck. You know, fear of, you know, if I end the relationship, will I find somebody else or somebody quote better or whatever that looks like? Um, it's fear, and then that fear does several things. So it keeps us stuck in a relationship, maybe that doesn't fit, maybe it never has, or at least it's not serving somebody in the present. Or it leads them to overlook red flags or just or to kind of downplay them, pretend it's not really happening, especially, you know, a lot of people think it's very easy to leave, or people know when they're in an abusive relationship, but so much abuse isn't physical. So, like, you know, you don't have bruises to look at and you're like, wait, did that really happen? You know, it's emotional. I served on the board of a nonprofit for several years and whose mission it is to financially empower domestic abuse survivors. And through that process, I learned 99% of people who are in an abusive relationship are also being financially abused. So it's abuse is not about violence per se, it's about coercion, control, power. Um, and the other fear that people the make the other reason people stay a lot of times out of fear is they're not sure what will be next. So it's that uncertainty. You know, we stay with the unhappiness that we know because it's certain. It takes a lot of courage to step into the unknown. And for a lot of people, you know, leaving a relationship they've been in for a long time is that is that unknown. And so they'd rather stay. And then there's also the regret piece. I know that was one thing that kept me in my first marriage for way too long was what I regret what ending the relationship, the impact that would have on my children. Would I but I look back with regret, and so long as long as you're staying stuck, you're like, well, I don't have regrets. What I learned later was I regretted staying so long because my children learned really destructive and unhealthy relationship dynamics that maybe they wouldn't have learned if I'd called it quit sooner.

SPEAKER_01: 4:15

I agree. I agree. And that's such an important uh distinction because confusion often is not about the lack of information, but it's all about the emotional overload, like you were mentioning. And obviously mixed uh signals as well.

SPEAKER_00: 4:32

So um Yeah, I and I think the inclination also to kind of lie to ourselves or I've grown to see it as we betray ourselves. We tell things, we tell ourselves things are fine when like our bodies are telling us things are not fine. And that's that's what I've spent the last few years really building is I didn't have it. I'm a researcher and I didn't really know what the research was related to what drives relationship satisfaction and health. And so giving people tools that really help them that are grounded in research that help them figure out okay, is this relationship like fixable or not? I think that's key.

SPEAKER_02: 5:12

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01: 5:14

Exactly, exactly. And also I'm very curious about uh the misconception. Like according to you, what is the biggest myth that people believe about good relationships that actually keeps them stuck in unhealthy ones? Right.

SPEAKER_00: 5:31

Yes, I think one of the biggest ones that keeps people especially stuck is and especially if they come from a background that's more especially, there's a lot of social or religious pressure to stay married. And so the misconception is that, you know, commitment is the most important thing and that if you're committed, everything will be fine. And unfortunately it's not, you know, it doesn't work that way because there are two people involved. And if you've if both people are really committed to making things better and making things work and making it a happy, healthy relationship, that's almost good as gold. But if only one person is in and the other person is partly out, um, it doesn't matter how much commitment there is, it's still not going to be a healthy relationship. And that's the other thing that um I think a lot of people overlook. We assume our relationships kind of exist within a container or a box. And I think if a lot of people who've been in long-term relationships that are unhealthy or un even just unhappy for a really long time, they don't realize that staying in that relationship is actually taking time off their life. Like it impacts our physical health tremendously. And so I think of it as having like this ripple effect. You know, if if you're if you're not happy in your romantic relationship, you're not happy at home, it affects our work. We know that for sure, and our productivity, we're more likely to call in sick at work if we're in an unhappy relationship. So it has this ripple effect that if you're in an unhappy relationship, it's really problematic. But then if you're in a really healthy, happy relationship, it has that same ripple effect, right? In a positive way. Since I got divorced and found a new partner, my career has just been up and to the right. I've done a TED talk, started two businesses, and so we think it's like our relationship is in this container, but it's not. Whether that's good or bad, it can be a little of both.

SPEAKER_02: 7:21

I agree.

SPEAKER_01: 7:22

So, like, um, I mean, how does that belief show up when people justify saying staying longer than uh they should?

SPEAKER_00: 7:31

How does the belief show up when they stay longer? I think for some people, they they're telling themselves certain stories. I think what if people have children, the story we tell ourselves or the belief that we hang on to that's um really a limiting belief is it's better for the children if I stay. I feel like you hear a lot about that just even in mainstream media. Well, you know, I came from quote, as we called it in the 80s, a broken home. My parents divorced when I was nine, and there was just like there's so much, I think, shame and guilt that comes with that. And so I think for people with children, they're like, it's better if I stay. And what they aren't recognizing is that depending on the situation, it can be much better for the children if the parents separate and andor divorce, because then each of the parents hopefully can get to a healthier spot, and then it it is better for the children. And and for me, that was actually um the tipping point. I had I still remember a moment standing in my kitchen and realizing, oh my goodness, these are these are the dynamics that my children are learning, and they're learning one of two things. Either they're learning it's okay for a partner to treat them this way, or it's okay for them to treat a partner this way. And that was just kind of like an aha moment. So I think that's one, probably one of the top three biggest beliefs that keep people in relationships that aren't serving them. Um, if they have offspring, they think staying is better. Quite often that's not the case. I think some of the other beliefs are one that maybe they won't find anybody else or find anyone better. I regularly go through responses to a partner lab assessments where people have responded when we ask, like, what brought you to this assessment or what's felt really heavy in your relationship or what keeps you stuck. And I had one recently where a woman said, I'm got married and like she was like 20 or 21. She's now in our very early 40s, and she's like, I'm afraid I have this has been my only shot at a relationship. And I just wanted to like give her a hug and say, Hey, I've I got out at 43 and found a new relationship. It does get better. But I think so many people, especially if they're even in their 30s or 40s or 50s, think I've that was my shot. I don't have another shot, and there couldn't be anything further from the truth. You know, the dating market isn't easy, but at least then you have hope for finding something better than maybe what you're stuck in if you've been stuck for a long time. What are your thoughts?

SPEAKER_01: 10:01

I totally agree. I mean, that really reframes things because um it's not about the endurance or the loyalty at all costs, but um I'd say it's all about alignment, uh mutual growth. And that naturally brings us to the science behind these patterns. So um exactly.

SPEAKER_00: 10:25

Yeah, and I think that's one thing a lot of people I I wasn't to be frank until a few years ago, that you know, we we are have a growing understanding, thanks to especially machine learning and just new ways of analyzing massive amounts of data about what are the most important drivers of relationship health and happiness. And so it if if if somebody asks you what's the most important thing related to relationship health and happiness, what are one of the top two or three things you you might say?

SPEAKER_01: 10:53

Uh for health and happiness?

SPEAKER_00: 10:55

Yeah. Just kind of off the cuff. What what what's your need jerk response?

SPEAKER_01: 10:59

Obviously, like uh in the health and happiness, like uh self-care, obviously, then taking care, taking care of the mental health, giving time to myself.

SPEAKER_00: 11:09

Yeah. And so we we know, I think, especially from when just moving through the world what works for us and different things work for different people. Um, but with what the relationship science says, is there are five or six factors that matter more than anything else. And so it's like how committed to the relationship do we think our partner is? Um, how much we appreciate our partner. So a lot of times people think, I want my partner to appreciate me. Like that's super important. But actually, what drives satisfaction is our appreciation for our partner. Also, our own sexual satisfaction in the relationship. I kind of think that of think of that as like glue in a relationship. You know, when life is hard, you if you can still connect in that way, that's super um valuable and powerful to driving satisfaction. Also, how responsive our partner is. So the Gottmans talk about like bids for attention. And, you know, when we feel like our partner isn't very responsive, not necessarily even specifically to our needs, but to something that we mention. Oh, this happened at work today. And if our partner is like scrolling on their phone, like, uh-huh, like um, that has a major impact on satisfaction, as well as some people call them abusive behaviors, others controlling. Like that's another of the top five or six that really bring down satisfaction. Not surprising, but a lot of people can find themselves in abusive or controlling relationships and not realize it, right? Because, you know, if somebody treated us badly on the first date, hopefully we're like, nope, hard pass. But it it happens slowly over time and it gets it increases in frequency and then egregiousness. And so I think the more people understand what really drives happiness in their relationships, the more they can focus on that. Because I think a lot of people would say communication is like one of the top things. And it's in there, but it's not the top six.

SPEAKER_01: 13:05

Exactly. So, like, I mean, from the from a relationship science, what are the core uh patterns that predict whether a relationship can realistically improve?

SPEAKER_00: 13:17

Great question. You know, I I think there are research and the science would say there are several just absolute deal breakers. And um, that's one thing Partner Lab is developing right now is an assessment that actually helps that gives people an answer to whether they should stay in their relationship or leave. And the kicker on the front on the very front end that should be a leave always, even if it's hard, make a plan is when there is abuse in the relationship. Like if somebody is being abused, whether that's physically, um, emotionally, financially, sexually, generally, those who engage in abuse do not change. That's what the research says. And so it's a lot of times not an outcome that people want to hear. I did not realize I was in a controlling relationship until I was out of it. And you look back, you're like, oh my gosh, how can I not know? But a lot of people, you just you don't recognize it. And so that's one. Like that's that's a it's a done. Now, every not everybody is in a situation to leave immediately, especially if you are a stay-at-home parent. And for some people, you know, leaving may put them in greater danger. And so having a plan and working with basically a support team, a therapist, an attorney, potentially even law enforcement, you know, if it's if they're with a partner who's very violent is important for for them leaving safely. So that's that's really key is to make sure that they are they have that plan, they're working the plan, and it's not kind of an up and out. You know, some people are in a situation to do that, but we never want somebody to make a plan to leave and not have a plan to do it safely. You may be aware the most dangerous point in any woman's life is when she the moment she tells a male partner that she's done with the relationship, you know, even those who think they're safe may not always be. So that's that's one important factor that's like, okay, it's it's time to go.

SPEAKER_01: 15:12

Exactly. I mean, I have to say that I really appreciate how grounded that is. Like, also, I mean, are there specific data bagged signals that say that this is workable versus this is like to stay painful?

SPEAKER_00: 15:30

Good question. The way there is data that points to that. I think the caveat is getting a lot of clarity about where we have control and where we don't. So there's all kinds of research that indicates what can make you more satisfied in your relationship, how to improve partner responsiveness. What I think for a lot of people, and especially women, tend to think well, it's my responsibility to make sure everything is okay in the relationship. The thing is that you know, we cannot control another person. And so helping people focus on what they can control, what's within their realm of control to either make the relationship better or to not engage in behaviors that actually undermine the relationship. And then, too, I teach negotiation a lot of it's conflict resolution and communicating effectively, understanding interests and things like that. It's also having a conversation, equipping someone to have a conversation with their partner that says, hey, you know, this part of our relationship, my needs aren't getting met, or I'm feeling frustrated, or I'm feeling hurt. You know, here are some thoughts on how we could address that. And then, you know, flipping it, finding out from the partner what's not working for you or what could be better for you. Like what do you want more of versus what you want less of? Yeah. So those are there's a lot out there, but I think the emphasis should be on what can the person themselves, what do they have influence over? Because you know, a lot of times when we try and control our partner, that doesn't end super well.

SPEAKER_02: 17:02

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01: 17:03

And also regarding the real life thing, I mean, in real relationships, how do these unhealthy patterns usually show up day by day? Not in a kind of dramatic moment. But you can take it as like uh the ordinary interactions, like so.

SPEAKER_02: 17:19

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00: 17:21

Yeah, that's a great question. Um, and like I noted before, I think generally it's a slippery slope. You know, it starts, and the research bears this out. Generally, it starts with more like emotional or psychological abuse, calling somebody names, maybe throwing things, trying to control where someone goes or who they see, needing to know where they are all the time. Like to me, a huge red flag is you know, if if somebody tries to keep you from hanging out with friends or hanging out with family, trying to kind of isolate you, they may not even think that that's their goal. But when somebody tries to control who you see and where you spend your time and has to know where you are 100% of the time, that's a big red flag. And I think for a lot of people, and especially women on the front end, that can feel like, oh, they're being protective, right? They they just care about me. They care so much. But a lot of times that kind of controlling and surveillancing behavior then follows a pattern of more direct psychological abuse, sexual abuse, and then physical. So it does kind of escalate from type of abuse to where um there were some people that I worked with when I was at the nonprofit Finability, who their partners had put them in the hospital. And you know, that that doesn't happen. It's not a one and done, and it happens very slowly over time. It escalates. And a lot of times that's what's hard to track. Here's where I think one one thing people can have trying to develop an awareness of is your body's gonna have a physical reaction when somebody treats you badly. But a lot of times we ignore that or we kind of um dismiss it. We're like, oh, you know, I'm just I've had I'm had I've had a bad day and I'm making too big of a deal. And the partner may say, like, you're crazy, you're making that never happen. You're like, dang it, I know that happened. And so really paying attention to what our bodies are telling us when your nervous system sounds the alarm, you know, pay attention to that. And I think that's a key for a lot of people who are in controlling relationships. A partner being controlling is they want you to doubt your reality because if they can get you to doubt yourself and your reality, you're easier to control. And for a lot of people, they do. I know I did mine. The last year I was in a long-term relationship. I seriously thought about installing hidden cameras in certain parts of the house because I because I would come back and say, you know, you did this or you said that, and the other party would say, No, I didn't. And I was like, I know he did. I know he did. And so, how how little part of abuse is getting you to not trust yourself. And in that point, I did realize I what I didn't trust myself as much because I To put hidden cameras in there to like prove to myself or to show a friend, like, I think this is happening. Am I right? You know, I never did it. No, but darn I thought about it for a long time. Yeah. And so those unhealthy patterns show up, but they show up slowly but consistently. And so they can they can be hard to track, I think, when you're in the thick of it.

SPEAKER_01: 20:20

Exactly. So what do you what do you see? I mean, what are the subtle signs that people tend to ignore until they are emotionally exhausted?

SPEAKER_00: 20:30

Um, let's see, that's a good question. No, I think part of it is they think they are being a good partner. Like I think there's a fine line between being supportive and being enabling. And it's not a distinction I recognized until, I don't know, I was in my late 40s. I thought, you know, trying to meet every need of my partner and giving them everything they wanted and never drawing a boundary or never saying no, like to me, that was being a supportive partner. And it was partly due to how I was raised in a conservative, high-demand religion. But what I realized after the fact, after I was out, is that so much of what I was doing wasn't support, it was enabling. Like I was trying to protect my then partner from the consequences of his decisions. And yeah, when I can't when I finally recognized what was going on there, yeah, I was exhausted. And so trying to clock or develop an awareness for and uh kind of a framework for, okay, am I supporting or am I enabling? Because enabling allows each person to be their own person, and I don't have to meet somebody's every whim. Whereas, you know, supporting is doing that, and then enabling is just, you know, you kind of give away yourself and you can betray yourself because you're just trying to meet every single need that this person has. So I think that's some of those signs, like recognizing are we doing more supporting or are we doing more enabling? Tell me if any of that didn't make sense.

SPEAKER_01: 21:59

Makes sense, makes sense, definitely. And it's I'd say it's very regrettable because so many listeners, it's often like I'd say it's often death by a thousand paper cuts and not by one big uh incident, right? So the big question becomes is like, yeah, I mean the here the big question comes is like uh what do we actually do with this awareness?

SPEAKER_00: 22:23

Yes, yeah, that's a great question. What do we do with the awareness? You know, I think that's part of determining. Well, I think the first question is where here do I have influence and where where don't I? And so we should have the latitude to say, yes, I can help you in this way, or no, that's not something I'm willing to do, and not have our partner lose their minds or throw a big fit over it. So determining where we have influence, what we can control, and um using that to potentially benefit the relationship. You know, if it's a relationship you want to continue, but especially to kind of cultivate and to protect our own peace. That's one thing I think a lot of people overlook is like if we're not taking care of ourselves and we're not in a spot to be our best selves as an individual, we can't be a great partner. And recognizing, taking that awareness and using it to protect our own peace, our own well-being, because if our well-being is garbage, we're we're not very useful to anyone, especially not a partner.

SPEAKER_01: 23:25

True. True, very true. So, like if someone wants to use relationship science proactively, what are the one or two practical tools that they can start using to access the health of their relationships?

SPEAKER_00: 23:41

Ooh, that's a great question. Um, you know, there are there are a number of tools out there. I think it partly depends on what they're looking for. Partner Lab in particular is operating in this space and we're we're seeking to serve people who feel like they've been stuck in their relationship for a really long time. So maybe one foot in and one foot out, which is so exhausting to be in that space. And it's not good for anybody, you know, it's not good for the person experiencing it, it's not good for their partner. Actually, there's brand new research on that. Like when we feel ambivalent, one foot in, one foot out of the relationship, our partner senses it and it undermines their health. So it's not like something you can kind of keep to yourself. People are gonna know it. So, with our offerings and focusing on those who are kind of stuck, not sure whether to stay or go, we've got a tool, a program where they can go through and the clarity circle. And really, it's a it's a super deep, deep dive into what's going well and what's not going well and where they have influence and what they can change. And in the end, if if they choose it, they can, it will help them decide whether they should stay in this relationship or end it and then walk them through the process for both. I think others are just curious, they know they have a solid relationship, but they know there's areas maybe that aren't working as well or could be better. We have a Clarity 360 assessment that measures 24 different areas of somebody's relationship and gives them direct feedback on each of those so they can say, hey, look, hey, we're doing really great on having a responsive partner, but maybe we're not doing as well over here in this area of communication or in expressing appreciation for our partner, so growing some of those things. So various options and partner lab also offers several free options related to like conflict. And right now you can get access to a January relationship reset. So, you know, in January, people are are developing all kinds of new goals and things like that. And sometimes relationships need to be a part of that as well. And so strengthening, getting clarity in their relationship that way is can be important again, not just for the relationship as we talked about, but it has a ripple effect to the rest of their life, work and parenting and friendships.

SPEAKER_02: 25:54

True. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01: 25:56

Hmm. And lovely. I mean, I really love that. And and also like when someone tries to improve a relationship or maybe leave one mindfully, then what setbacks also do you see most often?

SPEAKER_00: 26:10

Ooh, that's a good question. You know, one of one of the things I know from doing a deep dive into domestic abuse is that it on average it takes a survivor seven tries before they successfully leave. And so a lot of times the the dynamic, the first setback is they leave, but it's not permanent. They get pulled back into the relationship. Sometimes we call these cyclical relationships, and and they each time people leave and then go back, break up, get back together, it actually kind of strengthens that relationship and does more and more damage. Like the stress accumulates, it doesn't dissipate during that cycle. I think some setbacks are for a lot of people, the first setback that's quantitative is to their finances. You know, it can be tricky to take one household and then you're building two different ones. It's, you know, two rent payments, two mortgage payments, you know, things like that, those financial setbacks can be tricky to overcome. I think those are really the two, the one where they get pulled back in and then the financial. What we do find is that generally, I think it broadly speaking, it takes women a bit longer than men to kind of recover from the financial setback. But here's here's one thing that's really interesting is for a lot of people when they're going through a separation or divorce, their output at work goes down. Like for about 45% of people going through that process, it impacts their work life. But 40, about 40% of people going through that process after it's done, their output and productivity is much higher than pre-divorce. And so there's kind of this, there can be this rebound effect. So I think a temporary setback because you know, ending a relationship, whether you're married or not, and especially if you have kids, is super messy. Like it is complicated, it is emotionally draining, it can be financially draining. And so I think for most people, it is smart to kind of expect a dip in a lot of things at first, but then a positive trajectory, you know, I would say broadly within six months to a year after the the divorce is final.

SPEAKER_01: 28:18

So, like uh what helps people to stay grounded and confident when doubt creeps back in?

SPEAKER_00: 28:28

Ooh, oh, that's a good question. Um actually, I it reminds me I had a friend um when I started my divorce process who'd gone through it a few years before, and we were just chatting, and um she said, Okay, Meredith, watch out for fudding. And I'm like, Suzanne, what is fudding? She said, be prepared for your soon-to-be ex-ex-spouse to engage in um or to try and create fear, uncertainty, and doubt. So that's the first time I'd heard that. So I think one developing an awareness or a radar is kind of how I think about it for when that doubt is creeping up. Because I think for a lot of people, no matter what it is, the doubt creeps in, but we don't actually recognize it. And so we don't name it. And when you can name it and recognize it, to me, that's like 60% of the battle. So recognizing it for what it is, naming it. And actually, I you may you're probably familiar with the podcaster, author, entrepreneur, investor Tim Ferris. He has a TED talk about fear setting. That's where I would go is to fear setting. And so if we we're having those doubts, what is the fear that's attached to that? Is it fear about how this is going to impact the children? Is it about fear about finances? Is it fear about what the relationship with the the ex will be like, especially if you're co-parenting with them? Is do some fear setting related to that? So what's the worst that could happen? How can I prevent the worst from happening? And then if the worst happens, what do I do? But then the kicker on this, I think it's the fourth step is what will I miss out on or what will I lose if I don't go through with this? And so I think for a lot of people, you know, they recognizing that they can find a healthier relationship. And for some people, they're like, I'd rather have no relationship than this relationship. And so recognizing how much more of themselves they get to be once they're outside of an unhappy relationship and especially a controlling relationship. You know, I've heard people talk about, and you see it on TikTok some where people walk into their starting over apartment or whatever. And, you know, you get to put whatever on the walls, wherever you want it. You know, there's all kinds of freedoms that do come with that. And I think for a lot of people, I have a friend who after she got out of an unhealthy relationship, she she said she was driving down the street, stopped at a red light, and realized after about three or four days of her ex moving out that she could like breathe deeper. She was like, I felt like this massive weight was just off my shoulders. And so really channeling like what, you know, ending a relationship is super messy and it can be traumatic. But fast forward our brains to a year later, what might our life look like? And keeping that, recognizing that it won't always be the hard struggle that it is presently, that things can get better. And so don't don't let the fear, uncertainty, and doubt get you down, but do a little fear setting to to kind of manage some of that. It's and I think it takes proactive management for sure.

SPEAKER_01: 31:30

Correct. Exactly. Amazing. So, Meritadamin, if someone wants to connect with you, how they can connect.

SPEAKER_00: 31:36

Sure. Best way is probably through LinkedIn, or if they're interested in connecting in other ways or with some of Partner Lab's um offerings, they can go to mypartnerlab.co and um I'd love to connect. I love connecting with people who are in that space that I stayed in for way too long and helping them get that clarity, confidence, and hope that they deserve.

SPEAKER_01: 31:58

Amazing. So, dear listeners, what I'll do is I'll put all the details and the links into the show notes for easy reference. And before we move, um, I would love to, I mean, just to mention and summarize it. Like the the takeaway is very simple is healthy relationships are not just about guessing correctly, but they are all about making informed and self-respecting choices, right? So these are very important, and I'd say if today's episode has resonated with all of you, take one insight and sit with it before reacting or deciding anything, right? So clarity grows when we slow down and ask the better questions, right? So, with this hope, this is Mindmate's machine with your host awake, and thanks for listening, and I'll see you next time. Thank you so much.